Jesus finished off building a casket then He and Mack take a walk to the dock. Their conversation opens up what Mack’s fears truly are.
(Sorry this one is so simplistic… writing much more gives away the whole chapter)
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I honestly (mostly) liked this chapter… I did have a few -huh?- moments when Jesus spoke of His “submission” to humanity. Anyone else spend time thinking over this?
I can’t help myself…..!!!
“Now as THE CHURCH SUBMITS TO CHRIST, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.”
(Ephesians 5:24, emphasis mine)
Agreed Raquel. I think there is definately an aspect of Christ coming that involves servanthood – He makes that clear in numerous places. But Young makes a mistake in inter-mingling certain aspects of Christ’s deity/humanity as being characteristics of the Father and Spirit as well. Man gets elevated in this book in a position beyond what he ought, while God’s godness is diminished.
Jesus to Mack: “My life is not meant to be an example to copy. Being my follower is not trying to ‘be like Jesus,’ it means for your independence to be killed. I came to give you life, real life, my life. We will come and love our life inside of you, so that you begin to see with out eyes, and hear with our ears, and touch with our hands, and think like we do. But, we will never force that union on you. If you want to do your thing, have at it. Time is on our side.”
Scriptural basis? What are your thoughts on this one?
what page is that on?
bottom of 149
I have a question then. If Jesus was the perfect reflection of the Father, how then are His actions not a characteristic of the Father?
John 1:14 – The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
John 14:9-11 – 9Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves.
So when Jesus washes the disciples feet, isn’t this the fullest expression of the Father’s love?
Jonathan,
This is obviously a toughy that no one has the “right” answer for… debate could go on and on. But since I’m a stickler for debate, here’s what I’m thinking…
The trinity… so hard for my puny mind to comprehend. Three in one. I THINK that Jesus is an extension of the Father (just as the Holy Spirit is). I THINK that His actions certainly are reflections of the Father’s characteristics… but not an exact duplicate. If they were carbon copies, then why even have a trinity?
And Jesus’ submission to the Father was made clear when He asked the Father to take the cup from Him or when prayed to Him (check out Hebrews 5:1-10). But I don’t see the Father ever submitting to us. Nor the Holy Spirit (to my recollection but I could be way off).
This is one of those things that I can take a stab at but have little confidence in my understanding. It sho’ is fun to grapple with, though!
Be careful Raquel. You sound like an Emergent.
Jesus’ fullest example of His Father’s love was His death. “No greater love has a man than this: that he lay down his life for another.”
By definition love is putting the other first, and in that sense God submitted to us by sending Jesus to die for us. John 3:16 says this clearly that God so loved us…
The other part of that Raquel is that husbands should love their wives as Christ loved the church (He died for the church) – and a willing to die assumes a lot more, such as willing to listen and spend time with, a willing to forgo sports events, a willing to do whatever it takes to help her fulfill her dreams, etc. Read Ephesians again substituting husbands for Jesus and wives for the church.
Nicole – the quote on 149 refers to the fact that we can’t do the Christ following on our own strength. We have to die to selves (which is, by the way, the doctrine of entire sanctification) in order to follow Jesus. It is changing from the outside in, not just changing our behavior. This is the frustration someone talked about earlier on priorities, and how God seemed so low on the list. Dying to self doesn’t mean we ignore our spouses and kids and do the “real” work of God, but that in dying to self we are serving God while we serve our families and those beyond; and we are impowered to do it in a way beyond what we are capable of in our own strength. It’s Christ in us…
I thing that the it was a logical thing to say that he saw god becuse in the bible say moses that if he ever saw him he would die